VG33 (Xterra) Swap - 2022

[icehouse]

Swap the single Cam into the Z!! with a turbo it would improve the balance too.

[JonnyCanuck]

Welp. Couldn't log in since whenever I last posted using this user ID, so it's been a little bit.

Sometimes it's good to take time away from a thing in any case, give you a chance to assess.

In this case, if anyone is still interested in chatting about it, or sharing any information they may have, I'd like to steer things away from the discussion of which engine is "best" and which swap a person aught to do, and maybe try to pick up the pieces on the VG33 discussion.

If any of the unanswered questions about the trans/transfer case/4wheel drive snout etc... remain unknown, then definitely so be it, but they would be interesting to have answers to. I will chase this down on ratsun a little, or see if I can find an Xterra fansite that might have answers.

Also, still curious is anyone out there has, or is willing to take photos of any of the conversion stuff that Experimental Engineering or Team Thump used to make. Never hurts to have a mental picture of a thing that was done before and works.

For the record, the cheap Xterra is gone, and in the intervening months I had a few things come up that sapped all my fun project money, then all my rainy day money. So, I'm broke and pinching pennies while I try to refill the rainy day fund in this hellscape of an economy!!

I still think it would be cool to take a second look at how best and cheaply fit a VG33 into a 510, partly because I've read many accounts of people who think it's the greatest swap they've driven for the dollar, and right now it's an engine that is available everywhere I look, and often for hundreds of dollars, while all other options are hard to find and usually thousands to start....

[loungin112]

I used to have a 2008 Xterra with a VG40DE. I loved that engine. Lots of torque in a somewhat compact package. The most glaring defect with the engine is that the timing chain tensioner is plastic and wears out around 100k miles or so, resulting in a costly tear down of the front case. I would have loved to supercharge the thing, but I ended up selling it. Size wise, I think it is somewhat similar in size to the VG33DE. Just my 2 cents. Lots of xterras finding their way to the junk yards that have been beaten up.

[JonnyCanuck]

In case anyone else is still even remotely interested in something like a VG swap these days. Someone is still making engine mounts for a VG to drop into a 510.

https://puckerfactoryfab.com/products/6 ... wap-mounts

The promised trans mounts haven't appeared on the site in the year I've been looking at it, but that (to me) is a relatively much easier thing to fabricate ones self.

I did quite a LOT of digging, and only realized much much later that aforementioned S12 chassis V6 exhaust manifolds are ridiculously rare. Like they only built them for the US to meet homologation rules. So.... I have 100% struck out on finding a set anywhere. This leaves finding a set of Experimental Engineering or Team Thump headers used, which is a bit of a long shot, but who know. OR Making a set of your own.

I would personally prefer the simplicity of a set of cast manifolds vs. tubular headers, but it really doesn't seem like that is much of an option short of finding a unicorn set from a 200SX.

I did make a sort of connection with Dave of EE via someone in the turbo Subaru world, so we'll see if that goes anywhere.

On the other hand, VG33s remain cheap and plentiful in my part of the world, and my local pick n save yard sells engines for $520 CAD plus tax for an complete engine with all accessories. D21 Hardtop intake manifolds are surprisingly still easy to find, and maybe Maxima ones could be had as well. I personally like the idea of the long tube intake for more torque if they can me made to fit under the hood with the Pucker engine mounts, but this all remains theoretical.

So. I am still not ignoring the advice of others, but again, at least in MY used parts market, KA24 are getting increasingly hard to find, and the point of entry seems to be a couple thousand for something with no real history, and let's be real here.... since we never got KA powered Xterras in Canada, it will probably have come out of car that was flogged pretty hard.

SR20Ts are still $5k, and there isn't a proven method for throwing a K2x into a 510 yet that I've seen. I've got the capacity to do basic fabrication and some electrical diagnostic and the like, but pioneering a swap is well beyond me. So, for the moment, the mighty K24 swop is out. NA SR20s are a reasonable price, and presumably even easier to install than the turbo version with all the plumbing that goes along with it... Supposed to be able to make up to 140hp on a pretty normal one, and maybe 200 with all sort of goodies and a tune... So I think that would remain a reasonable option, but finding an ECU from one of the few North America cars that got them might be a challenge. They're also yet another engine that was discontinued 20 years ago, so.... it might be just putting yourself in the same situation as the L, just with a little more lifespan on parts.

Still curious to see what the 2.5L Duratec swap looks like. I dislike Ford in a general sense, but getting something thoroughly modern with parts availability and aftermarket support for the foreseeable future would be pretty cool.

[icehouse]

The KA came in D21's till 97. We see lots down here after that it got the dual cam till 2003. I understand though. You've decided VG.

I would never run those mounts you posted. the shock bushing style mounts are the worst. Makes you car vibrate so bad. Can't even have a soda in your drink holder.

This is one of the VG's I did.

[JonnyCanuck]

To be fair, I'm not actually doing anything at all at the moment! I didn't buy anything related to a swap at all. Still L20B all the way.

I really hadn't considered that the solid mounts would be that bad, but reflecting on it, I suppose I've more commonly seen that style used in more race-oriented builds?

I'm just continuing to explore the options that are out there and see what is possible these days. And I really listen to all the advice going around, and I have seen your history here and the work you've done on all sorts of 510s. I would be silly to not carefully read what you write and consider it. But that said, for a whole pile of reasons, I don't want a turbo engined 510, and I think a realistic goal for a manageable and low(ish) maintenance cost car, something in the 140-160hp range will be plenty for me.

I should reach back out to Dadzun and see if he ever did pull the running KA24 from his, and if it isn't already sold. I would still consider that as an option, but I'm also a little more a built-not-bought kind of person, so it wouldn't exactly be my first choice.

I also wish you could take a walk through any of the scrapyards anywhere within a couple hours drive of me. I don't know how bad salt and sand are where you are in WA, but I lived in Oregon for a while, and if that is any indication.... the answer is not one tiny bit as bad as here. You'll have to work hard to find ANY cars over say 20 years old in parts yards around here. They just don't survive very long, so any of the potential donors from pre-2000 are looooong gone. It's Ebay or nothing for most of this. So, it the 2-3 years of casually walking through parts yards looking for bits for my small fleet of cars (1x Toyota, 2 x Subarus 1 x Datsun) I have seen exactly ZERO KA24s available. On the other hand, there are probably a couple VGs in the yard right now.

It isn't that I'm being deliberately stubborn about it, very much more working within the confines of the current reality of what is readily available. If I had 5-6K to spend on an engine, I would most likely spend that on a built short block and larger turbo for the Subaru, much better bang for the dollar than throwing an SR20DET into a car that I only drive every couple of weekends. I daily the Subaru as long as there isnt any trace of salt on the roads.

Help me find another engine option that starts with a $500 long block with accessories, available locally with no shipping etc.. and I swear I will investigate further. Honestly, even having to make my own manifolds for a VG33 install might be enough for me stay away. I still appreciate chasing down what is available today and seeing if this is one of the swaps that has (more or less) passed it's prime/is a relagated to the past.

[JonnyCanuck]

Actually, looking at the work involved in your K24 swap, I really do wonder if even with the cost of the trans adaptor to a Nissan transmission, if that K swap might end up being reasonably cost competitive.

As you said, they can make a lot of hp stock, are readily in every scrapyard you care to name, and the aftermarket support is enormous. Even working in the $500 cost for the adaptor, if you can get a K20-24 fully loaded with accessories and not jillion kms on it, you are still starting $4k less than the cost of and SR these days.

I don't love Honda engines personally for being all high revving hp and not a lot of low RPM torque, but it's undeniably a solid engine that is being thrown into literally all mannner of cars.

[icehouse]

I think in the end a Honda K will cost 2-3X what a KA would cost. Our Honda K trans adapter cost 1300 bucks but we wanted to keep the 71C transmission in our racecar. There are cheaper ones but really there aren't many good options. RX8 and BRZ are the only ones I would want to use in a 510. The rest are super heavy. There might have been a light GM RWD trans but in my book that's not an option. Like a LS YUCK! Then you need a intake manifold 500 or so bucks, exhaust manifold water delete plates, wiring harness, standalone ECU, just for all OEM parts to delete the AC and Power steering pump it was almost 300 bucks, oil pan, motor mounts. It just makes me miss the days of free single cam KA's and 200 dollar dual cams. Could slap one in, only took a few days and your 510 was awesome. Now you gotta be a millionaire and it takes months and months.

The engine is the heart of any car build. You just gotta pick what you love. One 510 dude down here has a single cam KA running over 20lbs of boost. He hit 10's in the 1/4 mile, but he finally blew up the motor, it was stock! now he's got a build one in his car and almost back together. He likes the single cam. It's the under dog he says. I personally like the SR but I guess if I started today I would be a Honda motor guy.

I drove a turbo dual cam KA a few weekends ago. He's got traction control!! So good! It's funny how with 510's is motor, motor, motor when really any motor will do. They are so light. No one cares about steering, traction control or even ABS. Actually even coilovers. I ditched the T3 units for some home brew and my lap times improved beyond belief!