Tig/Plasma

[PoorMtnKid]

I was just searching the local craigslist and I came across this.

http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/tls/2721340561.html

Just wanted to see what peoples opinions are on this. Reason I was searching for these items was because when I start the motor swap in the future I would think both of these would come in handy.

I have some welding expierence when I took a couple of classes in high school and college. Arc and Mig I can do, however I never messed with TIG. And the plasma cutter I would like to use just to make brackets and anything else needed to help along the way for the motor swap.

Opinions are welcome thanks everyone

[okayfine]

No experience with that brand. Inverter technology has brought down prices of TIGs and plasma machines, for sure. However, there's much more than price involved (and, in some cases, price is not relevant).

First thing, that machine in DC-only, which means you won't be doing aluminum welding with it. May not be a concern, but generally people who see "TIG" automatically think "stack of coins on aluminum parts." You'll need a machine that will do A/C for that.

The plasma specs are also...slightly bizarre. 3" per minute through 7/8" isn't a typical spec, so it's hard to compare. I'd suggest that material thickness is well out of the range of the machine.

In the main, your concern should not be price in particular, but longevity. With a Miller or Lincoln, you get a machine made in the US and supported by US CSRs who have welding experience. That, at least, has been my experience with Lincoln. I have also had cause to repair my 110V MIG machine (needed a new contact relay). While Lincoln didn't sell just the relay (and instead wanted to sell me a replacement $115 board), I was able to desolder and replace the particular relay, costing $3 and my time. My experience with the China machines is that they aren't nearly as repairable. My MIG has otherwise needed nothing, is 11 years old, and has run 50 pounds of wire through it.

As noted in my project thread, I recently bought a TIG myself. I looked around for a while and finally came across an eBay auction for a low-hour Lincoln 185 complete with gas bottle, consumables, and even the original receipt and manual. For all that, I paid $900.

[defdes]

I am always hesitant about "combo" machines... especially one that's priced less than what one of the machines would cost.

[PoorMtnKid]

You know when they say its too good to be true it usually is. I was just searching for some used stuff someone doesnt need. What my main plans were going to be for the two devices was one when I go to flip the cross member. Not sure excatly what would be best to cut it. I would assume a band saw would be the best bet. And Im sure my small lincon mig can handle the welds on that. But seeing your (Julian ) mani on the L20T your building made me want to try one my self and thats what I was thinking the TIG would come in handy.

The plasma would be for cutting out heat shields, the tranny mount, and any misc. brackets for the intercooler radiorts etc.

But thanks for the adivce guys!

[okayfine]

Good MIG will be more than fine for flipping the crossmember. I've cut crossmembers with an angle grinder, but a cut-off saw would also work - either method takes a bit more care. Bandsaw and guide would be even better.

TIG does come in handy at times, and is mandatory at other times (aluminum, or when going to thick plate, such as a head flange). I held off buying a TIG for a long time, probably longer than I should have given the projects I was attempting. BIG learning curve with TIG, though, coming from MIG.

If you've got the MIG and you're not planning to invest the time for aluminum TIG welding (steel's bad enough, I haven't even tried Al yet), perhaps a good plasma is next?

[defdes]

A Porter-Cable porta-band is also a great investment, it will give you the thinnest kerf available and incredibly versatile once you are handy with it.

[two_68_510s]

Only had their MIG welder, but it was well made and fairly adjustable (adjustability is good). I think this is a step up from the one on Craigslist without going through the roof cost wise.

http://www.eastwood.com/ew-tig200-versa-cut-kit.html

[Byron510]

I will caution you on using a TIG welder on closed box sections - like your front X member;

It's really hard to properly clean inside a sheet metal box section, and trust me TIG is absolutely intolerant of dirt, oil, grease or any other contamination. Don't get me wrong, a tig IS the right tool, but you need to be prepared and cleanliness is next to godliness when it comes to the tig process. MIG is much, much more forgiving. Besides, if you can't lay down a mig weld that you are proud of, you'll find TIG a PITA.

I'm not trying to discourage here, but giving you my hand on experience in the matter – been there as well.

As for plasma for cutting off brackets - you're likely to do a lot more damage than you think. Plasma is not a clean way to cut odd shaped parts, or used in strange angles until you are really good. Honestly your angle grinder with a high quality zip cut wheel, like the Walter brand, and you are way further ahead with a fraction of the cost. Then you put on the blending disc to finish off the job nicely with that same angle grinder (not some rough grinding stone).

Again, just my thoughts on the subject.

Byron

[510wizard]

Byron is right on about TIG, if you think that the metal clean, clean it again. ( I grew up in the steel fabrication business and my mentor, a journeymen old Swedish guy, always preached to me ,that if you wouldn't lick the metal you were about to weld, it wasn't clean enough). The metal has to be spotless and on both sides of the weld area.

I would not recommend a combo machine. If you want a TIG, get an AC/DC machine so you can weld any type of metal.

If decide to get a plasma, get a Hypertherm, in my opinion they are the best machines out. Plasmas are all they do, thin kerf, and great comsumable life. I would get a "Powermax 30", weights 20 lbs, runs off 120-220v and will cut up to 3/8" thick metal.

http://www.hypertherm.com/en/Products/H ... rmax30.jsp

[PoorMtnKid]

Wow thats great information to know. Had no idea about how clean the surface would need to be. I understand you want things to be clean, not that you would want to eat off it. I think before I go and buy a TIG I will look at next semesters courses at the local community college and see if there is a class that would not interfere with work that I can take just to see if its something I can pick up on.

[510wizard]

Wow thats great information to know. Had no idea about how clean the surface would need to be. I understand you want things to be clean, not that you would want to eat off it. I think before I go and buy a TIG I will look at next semesters courses at the local community college and see if there is a class that would not interfere with work that I can take just to see if its something I can pick up on.

A class is a great idea and practice.

[510rob]

+1 on the class(y) approach. I took an introductory TIG class at the local technical college, 17 years ago.

Since then, I've been vacuuming knowledge on the subject, gaining hands-on practice, and accumulating the related tools and knowledge. Once you "get it," it can be fun and rewarding. Before that point, it can be frustrating and challenging. Stick with it.

How about this option? --> http://sites.csn.edu/workforce/80hrtig.asp

[PoorMtnKid]

+1 on the class(y) approach. I took an introductory TIG class at the local technical college, 17 years ago.

Since then, I've been vacuuming knowledge on the subject, gaining hands-on practice, and accumulating the related tools and knowledge. Once you "get it," it can be fun and rewarding. Before that point, it can be frustrating and challenging. Stick with it.

How about this option? --> http://sites.csn.edu/workforce/80hrtig.asp

Wow I dont think I can swing that price right now lol. The certification is something I dont really care for. I dont think it would help being a Business Banker either.

[okayfine]

If decide to get a plasma, get a Hypertherm, in my opinion they are the best machines out. Plasmas are all they do, thin kerf, and great comsumable life. I would get a "Powermax 30", weights 20 lbs, runs off 120-220v and will cut up to 3/8" thick metal.

Bump from the dead. Looking into plasma cutters. Hypertherm 30 has come up. Anyone with experience on how it does 3/8" plate? A friend has the earlier 350 model and he says 3/8" is a pipe dream on his machine. I probably won't need to cut thicker than 1/4", but the flanges for the L20BT manifolds were 3/8" so it might come up.

Pricing similar to the H30 is this from Thermal Dynamics:
http://www.weldersupply.com/P/459/Therm ... sCUTMASTER

Way beefier machine @60A output. Also at the 100% duty cycle @50A.

The PM30 is Made in USA, the TD52 is made in China, which probably answers my questions about the two. Mainly interested in actual cutting capability with the PM30. Their "recommended" cut thickness isn't max cut thickness.

Also, is there a general rule on how much thinner aluminum needs to be relative to what you can cut in mild steel?