got a 91 300z na complete for swap, have ?'s

[Bears510]

after doing some more research, some input from people on here and an unbelievable opportunity to get a friends low mileage 91 300z NA that was just wrecked, I am going to get the whole car and pull stuff for the swap. other than the motor and tranny (tho I think I read somewhere that the tranny is a bit bulky and have to mod the tunnel quite a bit or get a dif tranny) is there anything else I can use off of it like the rear dif, suspension, brakes or anything like that I should pull before I get rid of the shell? or anything that anybody wants me to save for them?
Thanks in advance,

[okayfine]

This is one of the most difficult 510 swaps. It'll get you to your power goals and then some, but the road to it is long and filled with pot holes.

You're best off going here http://www.datsuns.com and reading about Dave's adventures with the VG30DE. I'd really suggest you choose a different swap candidate. But the VG30DE is also covered in the Engine Swap Guide from DQ.

[okayfine]

...and an unbelievable opportunity to get a friends low mileage 91 300z NA that was just wrecked

Oh, and while this is applicable to just about everything in the world, somehow it is doubly applicable to 510 dreams: "Sometimes free is too expensive."

[Bears510]

I hear ya...trust me...noones suggestions are falling on deaf ears by any means. I am trading my ford 347 for the z and cash...I know this is going to take some time...hell, still need to find a 510. (got a line on one..going this week to look at it) but I plan on driving my 510 for awhile as is all the while accumulating parts and so forth.
Thanks again for the link, I have read that one and it's filled with good info!!!
anything else salvageable from it that I can use?

[okayfine]

anything else salvageable from it that I can use?

Depends on your definition of "use." From a normal 510 definition, not really. Brake calipers can be adapted, but beyond that none of the big stuff is realistically usable, and the calipers only fit FWD-offsetish wheels, which may or may not be what you're planning on running.

It would be ideal to keep the Z as-is until you begin the swap, you will need lots of odds and ends that the Z is likely to have (fuel filter/mount, fuel pump, body wiring for patches for the ECU wiring, nuts, bolts) that you'll likely pass over if you have to junk the car soon. Or lose in the intermeaning years.

Seats, maybe, if you're going that route. But most of the mechanicals are of "not worth the effort" status. IMO. YMMV.

[Bears510]

anything else salvageable from it that I can use?

Depends on your definition of "use." From a normal 510 definition, not really. Brake calipers can be adapted, but beyond that none of the big stuff is realistically usable, and the calipers only fit FWD-offsetish wheels, which may or may not be what you're planning on running.

It would be ideal to keep the Z as-is until you begin the swap, you will need lots of odds and ends that the Z is likely to have (fuel filter/mount, fuel pump, body wiring for patches for the ECU wiring, nuts, bolts) that you'll likely pass over if you have to junk the car soon. Or lose in the intermeaning years.

Seats, maybe, if you're going that route. But most of the mechanicals are of "not worth the effort" status. IMO. YMMV.

use...isn't that always a loose term lol! ....anything will work with enough mods haha! but I won't cut the heck out of the car just to fit an engine in...but yeah I know what your talking about...
Well, I went and looked at the z, not bad actually, runs just fine and the only real issue with the body is the front bumper and fenders are tweaked a little. I have the room in my garage to keep the car until I am ready for the swap so I will probably do that. I know what you mean about needing this and that when doing a swap. When I did a VR6 swap in my 91 GTI, I was glad to have the whole car there as things came in handy from time to time..lol!

[icehouse]

Way to much work IMO! 227 HP isn't that impressive in comparison to how much work it will be. According to Doug at Up garage his CA put down 265 to the wheels with minor upgrades (SR T25 and a reflash) and that was at like 3200 rpms!!! Yes and he showed me the dyno slip on his computer(Gotta add that when dealing with Okayfine). It was all part of the sales pitch though Not that I have installed a VG30DE but I owned 2 of them on DE and one DET, the DET was built (fancy pistons, head gasket, studs, the works!!) just not assembled but the DE was together, way to big, so I sold it. If I was going to go to all that trouble of cutting and welding I would skip the VG and head straight for the VH45 Sell the DE and buy an E then turbo it, in the end it will have way more power and fit way better, plus Carter sells a kit

[okayfine]

anything will work with enough mods haha! but I won't cut the heck out of the car just to fit an engine in...

You won't cut the car to fit the engine. You'll cut the car to fit the transmission. It's a bigun.

[Bears510]

anything will work with enough mods haha! but I won't cut the heck out of the car just to fit an engine in...

You won't cut the car to fit the engine. You'll cut the car to fit the transmission. It's a bigun.

Yeah I have seen the mod needed for that, not bad at all tho. most tranny swaps you have to cut something somewhere to relocate the shifter. I don't like to re-firewall cars just for a particular engine. done it too many times and the set up to ensure no body twist, almost takes longer than the actual fabrication and install!!! ACK! I just finished one in my 54 chevy pickup as the firewall needed massaging to clear the valve covers just a bit, and then the tranny tunnel was rubbing ever so slightly on the bell housing of the 700r4. easier to work it out smoothly then to cut, trim, tack, tack, tack, tack, tack, and so on haha!

[okayfine]

Yeah I have seen the mod needed for that, not bad at all tho.

If you use the DE 5-speed, you likely lose the stock heater due to the sheetmetal intrusion into the space previously occupied by the heater. Plus that whole reverse-mounted starter thing.

Ways to get around it to use the E 5-speed, but TNSTAAFL.

[Bears510]

Yeah I have seen the mod needed for that, not bad at all tho.

If you use the DE 5-speed, you likely lose the stock heater due to the sheetmetal intrusion into the space previously occupied by the heater. Plus that whole reverse-mounted starter thing.

Ways to get around it to use the E 5-speed, but TNSTAAFL.

ok...weird, I replied to this earlier but I guess it didn't post...hmmm
I probably will switch over to the E 5speed as it will be a more straight forward swap...by no means saying that you just bolt it up and it's done, however, the less massaging of the metal I have to do...the better. From what I have read they are reliable, sturdy, and pretty common to find so it looks like a better route. who knows, I may end up just selling the motor and tranny all together and going a dif route once I get my dime. in the mean time, I have it and will see what happens! now I just need to find a decent dime driver..ACK!!

[Bears510]

Sorry I have been away and abondoned this post...no..you didn't scare me away!!! lol! I have taken to heart and mind everything everyone has said and suggested and have been doing (or trying to) TONS of research, hence, my leave of absence. I can understand everyone being somewhat hesitant when someone comes on here and says "hey, I'm new here and I want 1000 hp, which engine do you recommend?" ok, I didn't really say that but you get the idea. But since you all are the experts and have years of hands on work with the dimes, I know that you all have probably seen way too many people saying that, never finishing and ending up with a cut up, unfinished project. TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE!!!!! I especially understand everyones concerns after reading the thread titled "Datsun 510 v8 swap question". Something like 7 pages where everyone was TRYING to help him understand the realization of the different swaps, research, hp to weight, research, budget, research and more research, in my opinion,to no avail and the thread died with nothing. So, taking what everyone suggested, I have been off doing research and since I won't do anything to the dime (might be picking one up this week...depends on the owner) until I have it mostly planned out (minus all the little stuff that ALWAYS pops up in swaps..lol!)
so I have a question...or so
1. I have been to the vg30 page several times and read and re-read the pages as well have read the vg30de swap done a few years ago. great info on those page btw. But in my research, there are some differences in the block from the vg30e and the vg30de. Does anyone know if the motor mounts are located in the same place or not? I have not been able to find out. I have asked for info from vg30.com but as of yet, have not heard anything. probably busy making parts!! lol!
2. I can't seem to nail this one down in research so I will offer it up for your opinions as you have driven them. What is the best year, make and model to get a 5 speed out of in your opinion as there seem to be different gear ratio's over the years, availabilty, price and such. Also, I don't want to hack the tunnel at the firewall just to fit the 300zx when there are other tranny's available where the fabrication would be less extensive.

Your help in this research is going to be a driving force in the direction I go. I have a vg30de NA that is good to go and the information at datsuns.com was VERY helpful and infomative. but it is not set in stone yet as the research continues.
Again, I would like to thank everyone for the help in advance, it is greatly appreciated.

[okayfine]

1. I have been to the vg30 page several times and read and re-read the pages as well have read the vg30de swap done a few years ago. great info on those page btw. But in my research, there are some differences in the block from the vg30e and the vg30de. Does anyone know if the motor mounts are located in the same place or not? I have not been able to find out. I have asked for info from vg30.com but as of yet, have not heard anything. probably busy making parts!! lol!

You'll have to ask Carter, who handles ordering and PR for EE. Dave is unlikely to return your e-mails.

Carter Boad: CarterB@Electroimpact.com

That said, searching via the BB list archives reveals:

"I know that when using the Experimental Engineering motor mounts, one or two of the motor mount bolt holes that are used with the VG30 are not used with the VG30DE. Otherwise, they bolt right up. I think I remember Dave saying the customer has the option of just leaving out the bolt or drilling a new hole in the mount? I don't remember exactly."

2. I can't seem to nail this one down in research so I will offer it up for your opinions as you have driven them. What is the best year, make and model to get a 5 speed out of in your opinion as there seem to be different gear ratio's over the years, availabilty, price and such. Also, I don't want to hack the tunnel at the firewall just to fit the 300zx when there are other tranny's available where the fabrication would be less extensive.

What are the differences?

Your help in this research is going to be a driving force in the direction I go. I have a vg30de NA that is good to go and the information at datsuns.com was VERY helpful and infomative. but it is not set in stone yet as the research continues.

How would your research put you off the VG30DE at this point? You seem pretty set on it.

[Bears510]

HOW do you guys find stuff using the search field! ACK! I guess I am not doing it right or something as you guys seem to find stuff pretty quick and I am left searching through thread after thread and not finding what I am looking for (user error I am sure!) sorry for "making" you find it for me, but I THANK YOU greatly if that helps at all.

As for the VG30de, yes, I have it, like I said before it was part of a trade/deal for my 347. however, I wouldn't say I am set on it and if I decided to go ka, sr, going with the L series motor and adding some power upgrades or what not, I would just sell the motor, tranny and anything else off of it people wanted. basicly the car was 500 bucks in the deal so I am sure I can easily get that back with the motor and tranny and misc parts. In thinking back to that thread mentioned earlier (what a nightmare) someone asked the guy if he had any experience with a 150 hp dime and said they are surprisingly quick. my gen 2 xb is just over that at the crank stock, and with just an intake, header and exhaust it is pretty peppy despite it's much heavier body. For that car, I would think 200 hp would be optimal for what I am wanting. for a dime, 150 hp may just be the ticket. I am still researching every possible option based on what is available already, what would need to be fabricated, purchased or designed. Maybe I am just over annalyzing it all which I tend to do but that has kept me from making some serious errors in swaps and mods. I guess I need to find somebody that has a dime with a certain motor and have them take me for a drive to see what it is like or just something with a known hp/tq so that I can compare....but then I start thinking about hp/tq curves, where it all really comes together and so on! The dime that I am hoping to pick up is stock...pretty much bone stock other than a weber carb on it and not that the carb is going to make a huge difference, but it needs help in the power area lol! I am by no means afraid to tackle the vg30de swap, I think it might be fun, but I am still checking things out.
I will try to find the page about the different ratio's on dif years for the tranny's, I thought I bookmarked it but I couldn't find it to copy and paste in here. Probably buried in all the research bookmarks...lol!
I will write carter just to verify but thanks for the link as well as the find in the archives!

[okayfine]

I wouldn't say I am set on it and if I decided to go ka, sr, going with the L series motor and adding some power upgrades or what not,

I still think the full, two-issue Engine Swap Guide would make for some good reading for you.

my gen 2 xb is just over that at the crank stock, and with just an intake, header and exhaust it is pretty peppy despite it's much heavier body. For that car, I would think 200 hp would be optimal for what I am wanting. for a dime, 150 hp may just be the ticket.

When I had my KA510 I followed an xC with the TRD supercharger on a long freeway onramp. We were evenly matched. Gen 2 xbox is like 600 pounds heavier than Gen 1, so if you thought that was peppy, you'll be very surprised how quick a KA510 is.

I am still researching every possible option based on what is available already, what would need to be fabricated, purchased or designed. Maybe I am just over annalyzing it all which I tend to do but that has kept me from making some serious errors in swaps and mods.

You should sort out desired powerband, HP stock and potential HP with modifications, cost, difficulty of installation, parts availability/installation knowledge (if you end up with a CA or something), and expected use of the car, then narrow down your engines. Then get some seat time if possible.

Due to the light weight of the 510, power/torque has more impact than you might be used to. By assessing things the way I laid 'em out above, you quickly eliminate choices. Fewer choices make a more manageable decision.